WATER TECHNOLOGY BULLETIN BOARD
Posted By Rich DiPaolo on 1/12/2010 at 11:19:08 AM
 

How do regulations affect the way you sell goods and services to your customers? Is understanding local and national water treatment regulations important to customers or does price and product availability matter most? Also, what specific ways do you share news about regulations to customers?
 
 


Responses:

RE: Regulations: jim wark: 1/12/2010 1:28:45 PM
I have been in the water treatment field for almost 30 years now. The problem with people caring about regulations and standards are the fact that there is no unity in the industry to create uniform agreed standards.
Whether you regulate based on technical specs or by certified results, companies will always be out there to claim that theirs meets or exceeds these so called specs but whether they do or not will always talk their way around them. How  would you for example regulate or specify efficiency of a non ion exchange conditioner (magnetic, catalytic or nucleation based) ???
How about water softener efficiency? Do you go by the tank mfgr., the valve mfgr. or the resin manufacturer for claims made? Does the assembler then need to be the one to verify claims of all and have his assembled unit certified?
The industry has had its great moments and I'm ashamed to admit that it has had its less than spectacular moments. Unfortunately for now, all we can do is police ourselves and hope that by educating our customers properly, getting true customer support from our suppliers and treating each job professionally and honestly, hoping that the dishonest individuals will starve themselves out of the mainstream.
As to regulations, we can only work within the guidelines set forth by people we hope have the information to make correct decisions for the industry ( CALIFORNIA can you hear this ? ).
The WQA is a great place to start, but we need to do more educating of our customers. Now in the harshest of economic and regulated times is the time to invest in education and relationship building with your current and future customers. Our individual and collective businesses will depend on it !!

RE: Regulations: Marianne Metzger: 1/12/2010 2:40:04 PM
Rich,
 
There are four states which have specific requirments for selling residential water treatment equipment, California, Iowa, Wisconsin and Massachusetts.  If selling in any of these states you should review the requirments.  They may require testing on your equipment depending on what claims you may be making. 

RE: Regulations: Gary Schreiber, CWS VI: 1/12/2010 10:44:02 PM
I'm not sure of what you are asking for Rich, but here is what I think on the subject.

If you mean "Government RegulationRequirements" there are many that affect the way we sell water treatment goods and services.  Two of which follow.  The MCL Regulations and the SMCL Regulations.

We, first, must know and understand what arethe rules of the game.  In other words, some of the rules help us sell water treatment goods and services.  Some of them restrict sales as referred to by Jim Wark above.  One of the helpful areas is in the water quality standards specified by the EPA in the Primary Drinking Water Regulations.  The Maximum Contaminant Levels (MCL) Regulations and the Secondary Maximum Contaminant Levels (SMCL) Regulations.  These tell consumers what are acceptable limts for drinking water quality.  We use these to impress upon consumers the need to treat their water. 

FDA is another government agency with regulations that affect the way we sell water treatment.

Those are Federal regulations.  There are also, as mentioned by Marianne above, State and Local government regulations that we follow and use.

There are, of course, other non-governmental agencies such as the USP, ANSI/NSF, NCCLS, AAMI, ASTM and CAP that have standards that could be considered regulations.  Their standards also affect the way we sell water treatments systems and services.

Sometimes, more often than not, they are important regulations to consumers who know and understand them.  The "not" part of that is one of our responsibilities to inform consumers of the reasons that they are important.  Sometimes the consumer does not know them and that, again, is one of our responsibilities which is to inform those consumers of those regulations and educate them.

Does price and product availability matter most?  Absolutely.  Those are factors that a consumer will use in their decision making process. 

Many of us have a variety of ways to share the news with customers.  One of those ways is to share information provided by our trade magazines such as Water Technology magazine and, of course, others with the consumer.  Another is by local advertising in the variety of media that is available.  Newspapers, radio and TV.  Those media are always interested in interviews and stories about water quality.  Another is by publishing Newsletters and setting up a Distribution Network using email or snail mail.  Another, and the most prevalant, is during sales presentations to prospects. 


RE: Regulations: Dave Hedger: 1/13/2010 3:31:01 PM
I think the water treatment dealer has a responsibility to educate his clients about the safety of their water.  That involves distinguishing fact from fiction, as well as the science from the silliness.  Unfortunately, much of the regulatory industry is driven by politics and emotion.  With advances in analytical chemistry, we are able to detect more contaminants at lower concentrations.  Arsenic is a prime example.  Using ICP/MS, we can "see" as little as a part per billion in water.  That, coupled with a plethera of "studies", largely in third world countries like Bangladesh, where the impoverished  populace suffers from horrible health conditions, a mandate in the Clean Water Act requiring the EPA to periodically ratchet down the standards for drinking water (whether or not it's warranted), and the popular view that "arsenic is poisonous, period", have contributed to the current 10 ppb EPA limit.  Nevermind that arsenic is used in certain medications, and in fact in trace amounts is beneficial to health.  A similar case could be made for other "primary pollutants."  And no, I don't want to go on record as saying "arsenic is good for you!"
 
Don't mean to get carried away, but the point is the competant water treatment dealer should be able to put things in perspective for the client.  We have all fielded questions like, "Don't softeners put salt in the water, and isn't salt bad for you?"  
 
Chlorination of drinking water has arguably saved millions of lives.  But it also spawns nano-quantities of dioxins and other chlorinated biproducts that result in headlines that we are poisoning our water.  And on it goes.  So, the water treatment dealer needs to educate his client to the real problems involved, and objectively present treatment options. 

RE: Regulations: Bill Black: 1/14/2010 10:01:30 AM
Allow me to respond to your question.  I bring a unique perspective to the subject of regulations.  I have designed and sold residential and commercial water treatment equipment for the past 10 years.  Prior to that, I inspected public water systems for the State of Ohio for five years.  I am certified by the State of Ohio as a water operator 3.  (That, plus $1 will get you a cup of coffee, and I have more questions than I have answers.)
 
I've seen a few horror stories, where a facility was providing untreated drinking water from an unprotected lake, or a spring that was laced with bacteria.  By and large, however, I found most water systems were adequate.  As an inspector, I worked primarily with mom and pop operations -- restaurants, campgrounds, churches -- that relied on a well for their water.  Most were uncomplicated; the ones that did have equipment beyond a softener occasionally had no idea what the equipment was nor what it did, but that usually didn't affect health.
 
Since I began selling conditioning equipment, I've worked more extensively with the Lead and Copper regulations and the Arsenic regulations.  My personal opinion is that Ohio missed a chance at a simple fix, choosing instead high tech, engineered solutions.   Providing bottled drinking water would protect the vast majority of people who would consume water in those facilities, with those conditions, at a saving of potentially millions of dollars, statewide.
 
I also believe that our regulations have prevented many public water systems from providing further treatment.  If I determine that a residence would benefit from softening, or chlorination for iron or sulfur removal, or an iron filter, I can have that equipment installed within a week for less than $3500.  On the other hand, if a public water system decides it would like to soften (or chlorinate, or filter) its water, I have to first obtain a permit to install from Ohio EPA, complete with an engineered drawing of the installation, and wait for four to six weeks for that approval.  Once the softener is installed, the facility may be required to bypass some hard water, and will be required to have periodic, expensive, laboratory tests of the hardness.  This despite the fact that there is no maximum contaminant level for hardness.  Installing a softener in a public water system in Ohio could easily run over $5000.
 
I don't get involved in well drilling, but in Ohio if you wish to drill a new well for a public water system, you first have to get approval for the location from Ohio EPA; you then have to run a pump test, and run a $800 to $1000 laboratory analysis.  (Does anyone know how many well tests have come back above an MCL?)  Once the well has been drilled, a permit to install has to be obtained from the Agency for the connection to the water system, even though that may simply be running a water line to the existing pressure tank.
 
As you can see, there is a disincentive to upgrading a public water system.
 
I did learn something about regulation from a miner back in the 1970's.  Ohio had just passed a regulation requiring strip mine operators to reclaim their mining sites.  I expected the miner would be quite vocal in his condemnation of the new regulations, but he surprised me.  He explained that he mined land that his company owned, so once he reclaimed the land he had usable land, again.  He felt, because of the new regulations, he could now compete with other companies that normally leased the land and left it as wasteland.  Good regulations allow ethical companies to compete.
 
I apologize for the length of this response, but I've only covered a few high points. 

RE: Regulations: dale abbott: 2/10/2010 8:56:45 PM
People hear about drinking water problems on TV and  turn to bottled
water.

The media, Any time their is any water related problem  on TV,
We have tried to explain to the media or get another opinion they will never
call.

They call a doctor not any water dealer. When you have the fox guarding
their own hen house and have connections alway to the state capital the
truth never gets to t.he public.

We have these water officials on TV and they always come with the head
man running the water compliance dept. They lie to the public so much and
we have proof of their lies. We had certified lab reports on our city water
and the PHD who tested the water. We are so fed up with Doctors who
give lectures behind closed doors to other Doctors telling them to take their
patients off city water and not to recommend bottled water, but to use a
1 micron absolute water system. When we approached this Professor at
Yale after lecture, He looked at my business card and said (their is nothing
 wrong with city water, the EPA is monitoring our water supply,s.
I had three people in this room and we all heard the same story. They
control the media and that is the way it is. Get the picture? We have been
trying for 27 years to work with the media to bring the real story to the
people. Dr. OZ is the only doctor talking about water quality and how
important water is to drink. He is telling the public not to drink unfiltered
water and to get a filter or be a filter. Also buy a shower filter. He did not
endorse any one product. When the media gets educated about water
then the public will. We have spent thousands of dollars trying to educate
we the people and they go buy bottled water. This business we are in will
go nowhere with out a water Champion to get on television and tell the truth. Water may be fine in your state, but not here. I am a master plumber and worked on water system piping and saw first hand what these pipes
look like. Now we will hear from another PHD after reading this comment
City water is just fine. When I am in the same room with these so called experts I want to heave. These guys are bought and paid for and it is
not doing the public any good. I have proof beyond belief and pictures to
prove it. They are from the guys who work for the water company feeding
my water system. I have lab reports and first hand experience changing out
water filters. You would gag when you see what we see. Water hydrants
have not been flushed in over seven years. Biofilm like mud in toilets and
oil slicks on top of the filtered water when filters are swapped out. When
you are a plumber and you have first hand experience with distribution lines
and are told that their is not a problem we just get so angry and just want 
kick their asses so bad. I will one day before I retire. I wish these so called
experts were in the ditches and the homes like we are every day they
would think differently. I have learned my craft from the source to your door.
These guys know that I am not just a company selling water filters.I know
my craft. We have parasites in our water system and the public is kept in
the dark. We have seen documents from the health dept. about Cripto
and  the info is kept from we the people. Most people will never trust
drinking tap water period. What is the sense of selling good water systems
when most people do not trust them? Education is needed soon!

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